Cleaner Test

Cleaners, typesetters, editors and redrawers
hanscau
Posts: 4
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2018 2:33 pm

Cleaner Test

Postby hanscau » Sat Nov 03, 2018 2:44 pm

Name: Hanscau
Availability: 4 hours from 1900 - 2300 (UTC + 8:00)
What Manga You're Interested In: Came here after reading "Alcohol is for married couples". Ok with anything actually, but isekai or romance preferably...
Software: Photoshop CC
Experience: Nope, but am willing to learn
Other Groups: None

Link to files: https://goo.gl/uyqLoD

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Leviathan
Posts: 8
Joined: Tue Jan 23, 2018 2:17 pm
Location: Hell

Re: Cleaner Test

Postby Leviathan » Sat Nov 03, 2018 8:01 pm

Hi, My name is Leviathan and I am a cleaner here at DT. I would like to start by saying that if you haven't cleaned anything before you have shown a great foundation to learn from. Some applicants get to where you are now after 3 or 4 attempts.

Page 1-2
Good job keeping everything straight on the page and properly sized.
The bubble cleaning action was used a bit harshly, destroyed some of the bubble but that is easily fixed.
Pages 1 and 2 did not require much cleaning, it was mostly to see if someone could straighten things out. The filter you used on the pages blurred them a lot, destroying the textures on the page. The goal is to keep them as close to what we can say the artist intended, within reason.
Don’t blur the page and this turns into a pass.

Page 3
Again, filtering until everything blurs. Not as bad as pages 1-2 but still visible at a glance.
White leveling as a little heavy and destroyed some of the lighter grey on the page (Against both the raw and your filtered layer).

Page 4
Page is straightened properly but still blurred. If you toggle between your cleaned layer and your raw and the texture of something changes, you did it incorrectly. The areas with black ink should be fully black (Seen in hair normally) and the areas that are white should be fully white, free of any dust picked up from the scanning. Always check your black-grey areas as they are the first to be damaged by filtering.
The blur is too noticeable to pass this page.
On your leveling, you go too far with your white slider. You don’t level to take out all the dust. You level to bring it as close to clean as you can without destroying anything on the page. After this leveling, you begin to dust the page with the dodge and burn tool to catch everything else. If you are going to use a filter, use a gentle touch.

Page 5
Well sized and straightened.
This page has a lot of black and grey which you destroyed with filtering. Your level is too hard on the white slider. Your black sliders aren’t bad, but you level out any white dust then blur out any black dust. This is incorrect. Again, softer leveling, softer filters if at all. Dust the page.

Page 6
Well sized and straightened.
Too heavy on the leveling, too heavy on the filtering. Whatever filtering you are using you both blur the page too much but doesn’t filter away enough dirt to which you then over level to catch back up. This is really noticeable.

Page 7a
Well sized and straightened.
White level again too harsh. Look at the sky in the top right panel. Turn your level off and on to see how it destroys the light grey.
Your filtering was not as bad on this page but still a little too harsh. A good step in the right direction.

Page 7b
Page should be downsized a from its 4k starting height.
Well straightened
Way too heavy again on the leveling. On this page you burnt the image destroying a lot of the transitional greys. Thin black lines, when scanned from paper, will still have some grey around them as it smoothly moves between real back and the surrounding white. When you level as hard as you did, these are destroyed, leaving very sharp lines which counts as destroying the image. This isn’t something to be fixed with a blur, you just need to level softer and go and dust (dodge and burn tool) the page.

As you may have guessed, you did not pass for this attempt. You are not far off however and with only a few changes you will have no trouble passing. Truly, the only things keeping you back were your leveling and your filters.
Come Hell or High Water, will come Hell and High Water
hanscau
Posts: 4
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2018 2:33 pm

Re: Cleaner Test

Postby hanscau » Mon Nov 05, 2018 12:49 pm

Thanks for the feedback, I'm just not sure what it means to dust the image. Does it mean that when overleveling the image to black, there shouldn't be any stray dirt everywhere? or just enough such that the image looks "clean" when it is overleveled?

Here is my 2nd attempt: https://goo.gl/9LdR5H
Thanks again in advanced!
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Leviathan
Posts: 8
Joined: Tue Jan 23, 2018 2:17 pm
Location: Hell

Re: Cleaner Test

Postby Leviathan » Mon Nov 05, 2018 2:07 pm

Hey, I'm currently at work so I haven't looked at your next attempt yet, but I will when I get home.

To answer your question, dusting is the process of using the burn tool and the Dodge tool to remove any specks of "dirt" from the page. These will always be found on the page and if you level enough to remove them all you are lost likely damaging the image. After you do your main level, create a second level adjust layer. On this layer, crank the black or white slider all the way to one side. You'll see either that the black is not truly black (they will look grey) or the white is not truly white (little spots everywhere). These are what you are correcting with the burn tool for black and the Dodge tool for white. Make sure your tolerance is very low on the tool or you can still destroy the page. I recommend googling "manga dusting" for a video that might be more clear for you.
Come Hell or High Water, will come Hell and High Water
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Leviathan
Posts: 8
Joined: Tue Jan 23, 2018 2:17 pm
Location: Hell

Re: Cleaner Test

Postby Leviathan » Mon Nov 05, 2018 10:03 pm

Overall, very good improvement from your last submission. Thank you for toning down the filtering a bit but there's still a little way to go.

Page 1-2

https://puu.sh/BWVgK/342be09432.png
https://puu.sh/BWViT/e57fe442e7.png

Look at the difference between those two pictures. One of them is from your raw, one is your clean. You are blurring the textures of the image which you should not do. If you make the page "fuzzy" you are doing it wrong. Stop using a filter for this page.

Page 3
Good improvement on this page. Not destroyed by filter and I can see you tried to dust here. You missed some spots here and there but nothing major.

Page 4
https://puu.sh/BWVB4/f394a20f91.png
https://puu.sh/BWVBI/b67fbeee11.png

Watch your blacks and greys. If you have filtered/leveled them out, you need to fix it either by erasing the "clean" layer just in the part where you destroyed the texture. This only works when the damage is minimal, sometimes there is no such thing as a shortcut.
Dont worry about removing out of bubble text such as the top two panels.
https://puu.sh/BWVJZ/3e4b0dcafc.png
Those white spots in the hair is "dust" that you did not clean. Yes, you did get get most, but I feel like you were not thorough enough as this is easily visible.
https://puu.sh/BWVOk/66ff6ea0a3.png
The black spots here are white dust that you did not clean with the dodge tool.

Page 5
https://puu.sh/BWVRQ/0ccd708423.png
Example of black dust not taken care of with the burn tool.
To make dust like this easier to find, make a new level adjustment layer and turn the level all the way up for either the black or white slider. This will show you where the dust is.
https://puu.sh/BWVUb/1726c3fee1.png
See? Much easier to find.
Image left in RGB instead of greyscale.

https://puu.sh/BWVW7/48c84f744b.png
https://puu.sh/BWVWu/5fa7752019.png
Watch your blacks and greys when they meet in "dark" areas. Your filter will destroy detail.

Remove numbers like the "15" from the margins.

Page 6
https://puu.sh/BWW9c/3035be7f2d.png
White dust left in hair and face not cleaned with dodge tool
https://puu.sh/BWWaa/fe8e27b748.png
Black dust not cleaned with burn tool.

Page 7a
https://puu.sh/BWVZr/482e7e1c1f.png
https://puu.sh/BWW0b/aed2e388dd.png
Those little spots are dust in the black. Not dusted.

https://puu.sh/BWW22/f2963e15fa.png
Those greys on their clothes and faces should be dusted with the dodge tool. I can see you made an attempt to clean this but you did not clean enough of it.

Page 7b
https://puu.sh/BWWf8/47fd034c12.png
Again, dust in whites
https://puu.sh/BWWgj/fcd769b0d5.png
Dust in blacks.

If you're able to brush up (no pun intended) on your dusting skills, you will have no problem passing if you chose to submit again.
Come Hell or High Water, will come Hell and High Water
hanscau
Posts: 4
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2018 2:33 pm

Re: Cleaner Test

Postby hanscau » Tue Nov 06, 2018 3:43 am

Hey Leviathan, thanks for the feedback again. I'm actually starting to feel sorry for having to need you to keep looking at my different attempts... But I am starting to get the hang out it, so here is another attempt : https://goo.gl/XQJDwM

Oh and sorry for disturbing you at work and thanks again!
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Leviathan
Posts: 8
Joined: Tue Jan 23, 2018 2:17 pm
Location: Hell

Re: Cleaner Test

Postby Leviathan » Wed Nov 07, 2018 12:23 am

Big improvement from the first time around. You got away from the over filtering which was your main detraction.

There are two things that you need to work on. Looking at your black/grey transitions to make sure they are not getting leveled out such as on page 5
https://puu.sh/BXxb2/17339f9a27.png
https://puu.sh/BXxbu/3e1c3dc3b6.png

https://puu.sh/BXxdL/4b97aa3356.png
https://puu.sh/BXxek/8b410682fe.png

and getting all of the white dust.
https://puu.sh/BXx4C/1b2632bb7f.png
https://puu.sh/BXxg1/1c6a4a1fc0.png (page 5 in your new submission was not dusted in the white areas.

I would say you are just about finished with the test here. Im going to give you a few pages of a good quality scan and I would like you to clean it.
The pages are to be Height 2400px Res 72ppi

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1HUZ4h ... Zg6Hd51xzt Page 3 is a double. I want it prepared to be redrawn. This means that you might have to delete some of the inner page to get it ready.

Also, when you are rotating a layer, if you want the "raw" layer to rotate with it, hold shift and select both layers from the menu on the right side and right click - LInk layers. This will transform them together so they are rotated the same. Very helpful for finding flaws in your filtering/leveling.
Edit: Threw in a few not so clean raws as a test
Come Hell or High Water, will come Hell and High Water
hanscau
Posts: 4
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2018 2:33 pm

Re: Cleaner Test

Postby hanscau » Sat Nov 10, 2018 4:02 am

Sorry for the late reply, was busy the past few days.
Here are the files: https://goo.gl/DgBi9N

Oh and thanks again!
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Leviathan
Posts: 8
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Location: Hell

Re: Cleaner Test

Postby Leviathan » Sat Nov 17, 2018 4:43 pm

Page 1
Much too heavy on your black leveling. A lot of things that should be grey turned black and it makes the page look extremely sharp
https://puu.sh/C3kEf/cd464a9abc.png
Heres the raw without your level layer,
https://puu.sh/C3kEs/c7cbdbc8ae.png
You destroyed the lines with your leveling there. You also pulled the grey out of the face texture.

Page 2
Same issues as page one with over leveling. On your dodge layer you also have your tolerance set too high. You destroy some linework with it.
Good effort on fixing the right side of the page. Thats about as far as it could get without a redraw. Put your page in greyscale.

Page 3
https://puu.sh/BZCmC/2f4ea1918a.png
Dirt in the black here
https://puu.sh/BZCnG/05dd557bac.png
Missed cleaning this area

https://puu.sh/BZCtU/459d3ca834.png - This is the raw If you look at the eye on the right hand side
https://puu.sh/BZCuR/b622a52347.png - You destroyed the art there. Looks a little sharp as well.

This is a crappy scan on a jpg. There is only so much you can do without redrawing and I get that. Make sure you dont miss dust though.

Page 4a
https://puu.sh/BZC8X/d2c605d27d.png
https://puu.sh/BZC9K/b0b7a8e0ef.png

Make a new level adjustment layer on top after you do you real page leveling. Use this new level layer to find what dust you miss. Theres a lot of easy to clean dirt you left on the face here.
https://puu.sh/BZCcn/7098687f20.png
Dirt on the clothing
https://puu.sh/BZCdy/273428f6ef.png
Dirt still on the building

Page 4b
https://puu.sh/BZCAK/28a33f2f1d.png - In the top right youll see there is texture here. It is part of the art.
https://puu.sh/BZCG3/c9296be3ab.png- You removed that but left dirt higher up instead of the actual texture.
https://puu.sh/BZCJG/cd4698ec4f.png

Dirt left in clothing. Making that new level adjust layer really helps find this stuff that you might not be able to see or dont notice.

Page 5

On your "layer 1 copy 2" you destroy the black-greys again. I dont know what the point of this layer was. I get that you clean up some of the white here as well but you then go out of your way to destroy the other textures.
https://puu.sh/BZCSe/6a5227a46d.png - Without layer 1 copy 2
https://puu.sh/BZCSU/92d8e984b9.png - With layer 1 copy 2

In layer 1 you also destroy the black-grey in some places but not others.
https://puu.sh/BZCVc/7f84fcabd0.png - Raw with your level layer
https://puu.sh/BZCVV/d67c5dce11.png Layer 1 with your level layer. It doesnt sort itself out on any of the other layers either.
You also blur up some things on the page and the textures change all together
https://puu.sh/BZD0o/d9bc439bae.png
https://puu.sh/BZD0R/98225d2352.png

Page 6
Much too high on your white leveling. You changed the colour of the grey textures but you still didnt get all the dust out of the white area.
https://puu.sh/BZD72/4ee8f2657d.png heres dust you left in the white.

Heres some tips to help you improve

1- Make a copy of your background layer before you straighten. This copy is your work area. The background raw and will not be filtered. It is to help you compare to see if you destroyed anything.
Hold shift and select both layers. Right click a layer and click "Link layers" This keeps them at the same angle when you straighten next. Set mode to greyscale.
2- Pick one vertical line on the page to level from. If there is none, pick the longest horizontal line on the page. If there is neither, try your best to find things that would line up and use that to straighten.
Zoom in and select the ruler tool. Pick one point on that vertical line and then drag that tool all the way to the opposite end. Make sure you now only have one layer selected and click straighten(Both layers move dont worry)
Pull out those guides you use to make sure they are in fact straight if so, remove the guides from the page (those blueish lines)
3- Crop only after you know it is straight.
4- Downsize your image after cropping.
5- Level. At fist, down bring either slide past the peak. If you do, only do it by a few points. If you are at the "slope" of the peak you are much too far and have destroyed the artwork. Filter lightly such as with a surface blur with low values.
6- Try using the burn and dodge tools on that "background copy" layer instead of a dodge and burn mask. If you want to use the mask layer for dodge and burn feel free but understand that while it is easier to fix mistakes it is easier to make them as well that way.
7- Make a second level adjustment layer to use to hunt for dust. Crank the black or white slider most of the way to one side to see where dust is in either black or white area.
8- Remove all things from the margins. Page numbers and whatnot (like on page 6) are to be removed.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1f1M3Y ... IsfdshhGki

Heres some more pages. These will be the last "new" pages I give you and once you have these to a satisfactory level you will pass. Watch your levels, remember to greyscale, take your time. Lower your tolerance on your burn and dodge tools.
Come Hell or High Water, will come Hell and High Water

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